Den norske fangstskuta bruker 14 minutter og flere rifleskudd på å avlive hvalen.

(Dagbladet.no): Dagbladet.no har fått filmen som er ment å sjokkere den Internasjonale hvalfangstkommisjonen.

I hemmelighet filmet miljøetterforskere fra miljøorganisasjonen EIA og dyrevernorganisasjonen WSPA den norske fangstskuta «Willasen Senior» under jakten på en vågehval.

Opptakene hviser hvordan mannskapet bruker mellom 14 og 15 minutter på å avlive dyret - der det tas i bruk vanlig rifle fordi harpunen treffer dårlig i den høye sjøen.

Filmen er fra mai i år. Dyrevernsorganisasjonen mener dette knuser hvalfangernes og norske myndigheters påstander om at hvalfangsten er human. Som hovedregel skal all hval avlives momentant - selv om det tas høyde for at uhell kan skje.

Offentliggjøringen av filmen skjer bare dager før åpningen av hvalfangskommisjonens møte i Sør-Korea på mandag.

- Den har allerede gjort et sterkt inntrykk på delegasjonene, sier Jennifer Lonsdale i EIA til Dagbladet.no.

Filmen er distribuert som DVD - først til den norske delegasjonen, deretter til de andre medlemslandene i kommisjonen.

- Flaut for Norge

- Bakgrunnen for at vi dro til Vardø for å fange hvalfangsten på film, er at vi har spurt norske myndigheter om videodokumentasjon i flere år, uten å få det.

- Vi mener at slik dokumentasjon er viktig for å kunne avgjøre om avlivningsmetodene er så humane som norske myndigheter skryter av. De har lenge hevdet at de er best i klassen. Denne videoen regner jeg med har gitt dem en flau smak i munnen, sier Lonsdale.

Hun stiller seg likegyldig til hvalfangernes påstand om at EIA hadde flaks med akkurat avlivningen de fikk filmet.

- Jeg påstår ikke at 14 minutter er vanlig avlivningstid, men vi dro til Norge, fikk ett opptak, og det tok 14 minutter for hvalen å dø. Med tanke på den hvalen, vil jeg ikke kalle det flaks, sier hun.

Krever innskjerping
Lonsdale legger ikke skjul på at norske myndigheter og EIA har forskjellig syn på om det bør drives hvalfangst.

- Men poenget her er at myndighetene må sørge for at den hvalfangsten som drives, foregår på en mest mulig human måte. Og vi er sterkt kritiske til at Norge ikke lenger har hvalfangsinspektører på alle fartøyer. Jeg tviler sterkt på at den elektroniske overvåkingsløsningen de nå skal bruke vil registrere slike ting som avlivningstid, sier hun.

Jennifer Lonsdale stiller på nettmøte klokken 13.30 for å svare på spørsmål om videoen og kritikken de står bak. Send inn spørsmål PÅ ENGELSK nå

• Klokken 14.00 stiller nestleder i Småkvalfangerlaget Bjørn Hugo Bendiksen på nettmøte. Send inn spørsmål nå!

 
Publisert fredag 17.06.2005 kl. 13:11, oppdatert 13:57

Send inn spørsmål til nettmøtet her!

Akkurat nå sitter Jennifer Lonsdale og svarer på spørsmål.
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Stuuupid....
    This is so lame.... It`s like the 23497234862343 most important thing to care about. You really need to open your eyes and see what else is going on in the world. It seems like americans care more about animallifes instead of people`s lifes.(dunno if your american)

    Sorry for my bad english

    Have a nice day.
    Innsendt av: hellokitty
Thanks for your opinion. I don't really see why caring about the welfare of highly intelligent animals should preclude me from caring about anything else. This is far from the case. People who accuse those of us who care about animals of caring more about them than people rarely make huge contributions to human welfare.

Jennifer
 

I agree

    This is not an acceptable way to kill an animal. But let me assure you that Norway is regretful, and that we are very concerned with humanity and what's best for our animals. However I do believe that the whalers up north have an unhealthy culture of doing whatever it takes to kill the whale and get it onboard.

    Though, we also have to keep in mind that as soon as that harpoon has been fired, there's no turning back. You can't just yank the harpoon back out of the whale and call it a bad aim and whish the whale the best of luck. I am sure that the whalers did what they could to end the whales pain as quickly as possible.

    However, in my opinion, they shouldn't have been hunting in that weather in the first place. What is your opinion on other whale hunting nations, such as Japan? And do they have methods we could learn from?
    Innsendt av: Peter Johan
I do wonder why the whale hunt took place in those weather conditions as I have been told on numerous occasions that Norwegians only hunt when the sea is very calm. Actually I learned that when I documented two hunts in 1983. I also wonder why the whalers did not use a second harpoon to try to kill the whale more quickly when they could see it had been hit in the wrong place.

There is a huge amount of concern about Japanese whaling and particularly its plans to double its minke whale in the Southern Ocean Whale Sanctury and to add threatened fin and humpback whales to its programme. Only about 35% of whales killed by Japan are killed instantaneaously. Japan is also using a harpoon designed to kill minke whales, to kill the much larger Brydes, Sei and Sperm whales and will do so with the fins and humpbacks. They have not carried out any research into developing a harpoon which may be better for killing the larger whales. I think it is best to learn not to do as the Japanese do.

Jennifer
 

Start talking to animals

    You better have chat with other predators(non human ones) like wolves, tigers and lions. Their prey is often eaten before their dead, Or their prey gets away mortally wounded.

    Nature is tough face it....
    Innsendt av: Torgeir
I don't think we can pick and choose which aspects of our evolution we subscribe to and which we don't. Humans have evolved a capacity for care and compassion that wolves, lions and tigers have not, so the comparison is not a very useful one. There is very little 'nature' left in the way the developed world lives today, so we can't use 'nature' as an excuse for our choice not to show compassion towards animals we share the planet with.

Jennifer
 

Fox Hunting

    Dude, I'm not fore whale hunting whatsoever, but who are englishmen to talk? All I can say is Fox Hunting.. They let a pack of dogs rip a defenseless fox apart, how is that any better?

    How about whiping your own ass before you whipe ours, eh?
    Innsendt av: Kristian
Just in case you have not heard, I am pleased to report that fox hunting has been banned in the UK.

Jennifer
 

hi jenny,

    someone has allready pointed out that the video may represent the minority of cases rather than the truth about whaling in Norway. I understand that this incidence is unacceptable to you, but weather one is for or against whaling, I think that it would only serve your case better if you had more evidence to support your case. Purely from a statistical point of view, there is a risk that one incidence happened by chance. It may off course not be, but to make your point stronger, I think that more evidence is needed.
    If flipping a coin twice gives 2 heads and no tail, this is purely by chance and it would be invalid to state that in the future it would always be heads. But by flipping it 1000 times, you may be able to prove your point in a way that will make more people support your case. I think that making valid argument with solid evidence and without bias would serve any case good.
    Innsendt av: mari
We would like to obtain more film of the Norwegian whale hunt. If the Government and Whalers send us an invitation we will be pleased to come and film the hunts. Alternatively it would be good if the Norwegian Government presented film of whale hunts to the IWC so we can all see how other kills take place.

Jennifer
 

Do you avoid whale-products?

    Do you avoid products made of whales, such as Make-up and gelatin?
    Innsendt av: Jonas
Yes I do. As a vegetarian I am careful not to eat anything with gelatine in, and I use Body Shop make-up products, which do not use any animal products and are not tested on animals.

Jennifer
 

How much do we know..

    ..about the way animals think and feel? How much do they actually suffer? Do you think the whale feels sad when being shot and killed like this? Do you think it feels panic?
    Innsendt av: I.R Hunter
I prefer to err on the side of caution because I cant know what a whale actually feels. Whales have a very complex nervous system and brain and science assumes that they feel a great deal of pain and will suffer panic. This is part of their survival strategy in the environment in which they live.

Jennifer
 

Surprise?

    Of course, every person, organisation or country should be able to stand against critisism. Many people around the world are against whale hunting, but not people in Norway, surprise?
    Yes, this film was only one shot, not telling the complet story, nevertheless a good film adding to the critics against whale hunting.
    Ted Jakobsson, Pediatrician, Sweden
    Innsendt av: Ted Jakobsson
The response from this webchat would suggest that there are many people in Norway against whale hunting! Thank you for your appreciation of our film.

Jennifer
 

Who gives a

    Who gives a rats ass about this?
    Fair enough that it takes a while for the animal to die, and they should improve their methods. But what else is so terrible?

    Dont see whats wrong with killing whale, people go hunting grizzley's for fun and shiz like that.

    Are you just for a swifter death, because thats fair, but to abolish this or say that its terrible is a joke.
    Innsendt av: Charlie von Kee'g
A lot of people around the world care about this issue. Unfortunately our research has shown that there is no way to guarantee a 'swifter death' and because of this am of the opinion that it should be abolished.

Jennifer
 

why do they do that

    why in the hell are they doing that to the animal, they had don nothing too that fich and they go around an kill it... way is it nesesery too do that why???
    Innsendt av: betsaveth
I'm pleased to hear that you feel so strongly about our footage. Spread the word of concern!
 

Whaling
    Whaling is a cultural thing in Norway, and we have hunted whales for centuries. Yes, you are right that they should be killed as humanely as possible, but totally banning it is ridiculous.
    Why not ban what they're doing in China, where they rip the skin of the animals while they are still alive? Or isn't that as important, seeing how that is happening in a "barbaric" eastern country, and not a rich western country?
    Innsendt av:
Just because we aer opposed to whaling does not mean that we are supportive of other animals suffering. We work on a number of issues in a number of countries and many other organisations are addressing the attrocities you point out in your message.

Jennifer
 

Far away from wrile life

    You and your peers have come to far from the wrile life. You have no understanding for natural prosesses and have a misunderstood and fundamentlistic approach to environmental protection.

    My question is: Do you think that hamburgers in the nature look as they do in the grocerie shops?
    Innsendt av: Wotan
I am a vegetarian and choose not to eat hamburgers. I am fully aware of how meat is produced. On a personal basis I am particularly opposed to the mass production of food for the fast food industry and do not spend my money in these kinds of places. I believe, after more than two decades of working in the field of animal welfare and conservation and living in the countryside for most of my life in several countries I believe I do understand the natural processes.

Jennifer
 

On an intelectually level

    As I assume you are an expert on the field, I find it interesting to ask you what you feel would be an appropriate way of hunting whale? I am sure you are familiar with the fact that whale hunting is a part of the culture in Norway, much the same as with the Inuits on Greenland and Canada. On the other hand, it would help greatly if you could say if you oppose whale hunting in general, or if it is the hunting method you are against.

    And people, reduce your hostilities in the questions, please. Let's keep this on a civilized level, OK?

    Thank you
    Innsendt av: Jon A
Thank you for your polite line of questioning, it is much appreciated! I have witnessed several whale hunts and have studied methods used to kill whales for many years. My conclusion is that there is no way to ensure that a whale hunted at sea will be killed humanely. I oppose whale hunting on this principle, and have additional concerns over the sustainability of the practice baring in mind the disastrous track record of whale stock management in the past.
 

Hopeless ...
    .. to discuss hunting with someone which is againt all hunting regardless of species.

    Stop beating around the bush! Admit it! You want all hunting to end and you want all of us to start eating gras like yourself.
    Innsendt av: Wotan
This web-chat is about whaling so I don't want to get into a debate about my philosophies on hunting. The video evidence shows an animal that suffers a prolonged and painful death and the prevention of repetition of this event is what we are talking about. I don't eat grass actually!
 

Vardø....
    Why is it pictures from Vardø, then from Lofoten..and then from the sea where the hunting is....

    When the information about the video is fake...what else is fake...????
    Innsendt av: Mona
The film of the hunt is one long shot from the begining of the hunt to after the whale is taken on board the boat when it is finally dead. The hunt was filmed from the shore looking out to sea.The documenters then went to Lofoten to where boats were unloading whale meat.

Jennifer
 

Why beat around the bush?

    You say in an answer that you are only criticising the methods.

    Most of the extreme environmentalists, and I guess that includes you, are against all killing of animals, wether it be fish, cattle or anything else.

    Why do you constantly try to hide the fact that you are not only after whalers, but that this is merely a first step towards a vegan society. I think you should come clear and declare loud and clearly to everyone: "We want to take away your dinner, and replace it with tofu and soybeans." Then people could take a stand.

    One person from PETA even compared the Lofoten fisheries to Holocaust......

    Innsendt av: Øystein
I have not said I am against the killing of all animals and I have said I am a vegetarian. I am not going to comment in detail on the production of food, only to say that if an animal must be killed it should be killed as quickly and painlessly as possible.

Jennifer
 

hypocrisy?

    Dear Jennifer Lonsdale

    I must admit that I cannot see the difference between killing regular fish and killing whales. When fishing, the fish gets caught in the nets and die a slow painful death. But it is the only way to catch them, and we need fish. The same reasoning can easily be applied to killing whale. Additionally If we do not kill whales, they will eat the fish => we don't get fish. Balancing an ecosystem is difficult but it should still be done. (Remember we have been killing them for quite some time now).

    If however your reasoning relies on the fact that they are mammals, well then look at bull-fighting. I do not see any restrictions on torturing bulls. Why? Because of the long culture? (like the one we have for killing whales?) And bear in mind that bullfighting is just for fun....

    If you it is the way in which the killing is done, then perhaps you could come up with a better solution, instead of just dismissing the hole idea. When you are ready for this, I am ready to contribute. Until then... No way!


    Innsendt av: Åsmund
The question of whether the developing world 'needs' fish is a separate issue which I will not get into here. The argument that 'whales eat fish' is highly questionable and many members of the Scientific Committee of the International Whaling Commission argue that it is entirely invalid. Also, we should remember that almost all of the problems/collapses in world fisheries arise from human overfishing.

As I've said before, I abhore bull-fighting and would not argue for a second that it is any more justifiable than whaling.

In response to your last point I will reiterate my position that substantial research has shown that there is no humane way to kill a moving whale from a moving platform.
 

Wild vs farm animals
    Do you not feel the whale in total leads a better life living in the free until it gets hunted than chickens that are kept in tiny cages where they cannot even stand up straight throughout their lives? I am sure the whale could be more reliably killed if it was bred in a more controlled environment. Saying it was technically possible, would you consider that a more preferred solution?
    Innsendt av: Kristine
I do not like the way that factory farmed animals including chickens are raised and I am a vegetarian. Due to the size and biology of the whale I cannot see that it could be bred in a more controlled environment so I cannot give you an opinion on it perhaps being a preferred solution.

Jennifer
 

start with your own country

    I think you people should find something else to complain about. Whaling is a great tradition in Norway. For starters you can start with cellarfield in yor own country. Punping toxic waste out into the North Sea. But I guess you don't care about that. In a couple of years there might not be any whales or fishes left in the oceans, because you people killed them. That is something you should worry about, not if it takes 14 minutes to kill a single whale. But i guess you got nothing better to do.
    Innsendt av: anonymous
Actually there are big campaigns to stop the disposal of toxic waste in Britain. Look on our website and you will see the breadth of the campaigns we are involved in. We are concerned about the state of the environment as a result of the changes brought about by man and are trying to do something about them. We are particularly concerned about the impact of environmental change on cetaceans as well as the methods used to kill them.

Jennifer
 

Fish

    To me, whales are really nothing but a big fish. 2 min or 30 min to kill it doesnt really matter to me. Personally, I think the whale-hunting is problematic due to the fact that diffrent experts have diffrent views on how much whales we can hunt. But when we have allowed whale-hunting, the method from this film seems as good as any. Without the (dramatic) voiceover, I wouldnt react on it at all.
    Innsendt av: Torgeir
Whales are not at all like 'big fish' in a number of ways. Most important to this debate is the fact that they are warm blooded mammals with highly evolved central nervous systems capable of experiencing pain in much the same way as humans do.
 

*shakes head*
    I think the video is disturbing. It makes me really inberessed to be a Norwegian. The "humane killings" are a lie. keep up the good work Jennifer.
    Innsendt av:
Thank you for your support

Jennifer
 

Thank you for being you

    Thank you. It is normal for us in Norway to put ourselves on our high horses and think the rest of the world are wrong and should keep their nose out of our way of living. I am ashamed of some of our fishermen and hunters who have a very cynical way of looking at animals, environment, it all runs down to two things; profits and money. So keep up the good work. And it is nice that some people have values like you and your organization.
    Innsendt av: Mie
Thank you for your support

Jennifer
 

Witch Hunt!

    Why this witch hunt on whalers? You only focus on things that went wrong, and never say a word of how well everything else went. It's not humane bla bla bla. Okay, I agree. THAT shot you got on tape was maybe not that humane, but that is because it was not a perfect hit.

    So let us focus on your work now. Are you always doing things 100% correct? Never broken any laws with your demonstrations, never? Never done anything bad just to get your story?

    If the whalers had not missed with the shot, no one would have seen or heard anything from your little tour to find a way to speak condescending of whalers.

    Grow up, face reality, and try focusing on the positive sides aswell. :)
    Innsendt av: Stian Domben Bårdsen
We dont break laws to get our documentation. EIA relies on the truth of its documentation to show what is going on.

Jennifer
 

What can we do?

    Hi Jennifer,

    Thanks for helping to put this back in the public spotlight.

    I hope you appreciate that most Norwegians don't support these barbaric practices. The fact that the authorities allow this to continue is more a reflection of the electoral system, and the incompetence and pure ignorance of the politicians in this country. In fact, the whaling issue is not on the political agenda at all. (Maybe this is because being against whaling is perceived as simply "un-Norwegian"?)

    Anyway, what do you think ordinary Norwegians do to help stop whale hunting? (I've given up on the politicians in this country).

    Cheers,

    Christian
    Innsendt av: Christian (Sydney)
Thank you for your interesting thoughts, I do appreciate that most Norwegians don't support whaling. I think the best way to is to build public support within Norway to bring about change.
 

This is...
    not a debate about eating meat or not, but how is it possible to kill an animal in a human way?? the outcome for the animal is death anyway. and from the hunters view, it's best to kill the animal as fast as possible to not ruin the meat. But sometimes the bullet don't hit the bullseye right away, and then the killing takes a little more time.


    Innsendt av: Thor Loenning
But our view is that it simply isn't acceptable for the killing to 'take a little more time'. These are highly intelligent animals, with highly evolved brains and central nervous systems, and complex social and family systems that we understand very little about. The margin for error in killing a whale is just too large to guarantee humaneness, so the simple solution is to stop killing them.
 

if people like you
    used such effort in helping PEOPLE, kids and women around the world instead of hollywoodmade friends, I bet the world would be such a nice place, dont you think?


    Innsendt av: Thomas
I think the world is a wonderful place. It just has some terrible problems. Because I care about whales does not mean I dont care about people.

Jennifer
 

Am I supporting EIA?

    Does this EIA receive any kind of support from the government? I hope not, coz I would certainly not like to support such people...

    You guys must be terrified by fish hunters in the rivers, that often have a salmon hooked for an hour before they land it.
    14 minutes is quite fast for such a large animal as a whale i think.
    Innsendt av: Jorgen
I am not comparing whaling with fishing in this chat. We certainly do not receive any funding from the Norwegian Government.

Jennifer
 

What else?

    When they didn't manage to kill the whale with the first harpoon shot, what should they had rather done?
    Innsendt av: S. Nesse
Without talking to the whalers involved I cannot tell you why the whale was not winched toward the boat more quickly so it could be more acurately shot with the rifle. I do wonder why a second harpoon was not fired at the whale.

Jennifer
 

wolves & bears in Norway

    Hi! I'm very thankfull for what you did.

    This movie can be so important for animal care.

    Just so you know, most norwegians don't approve this kind of hunting.

    I would like to ask you what you think of Norway's butchering of wolves and bears when there are almost none left?

    Thanks
    Innsendt av: cb
Thank you for your comments. I have read about the situation with bears and wolves in Noway and think it is a great shame and I simply do not understand the policy.

Jennifer
 

Good and bad

    I can only speak for my selv.

    It's is clear htat you have made a good point, pointing out tha fact that there are some whalehunters who dosen't follow given regulations on whalecatching. And on that point I can agree with you.

    But, I react on the angel you have cosen. Your message may have been missed because you are presenting this catch as a widespread problem. But, you only caught one bad killing og one whale. That only proves one crew of 5-6 people. I don't know how many whalehunterse there are, but I strongly disagre on your presentation. I hardly belive that it is a widespread problem and therefore a reason to stop hunting whales. That is my impression on this film. If you have presentet this film as a question and asked for improvents and followed norway up and made sure they followed some new guidelines.

    How often are other animals wounded during hunting? How often are these examples shown? How often are people that hunts for other animals been fined og put in jail?

    I hope you see my point. Don't waste your time and effort to produce "horror" tapes og wounded animals. It won't have the exact effect I think you are after.

    Any comments?
    Innsendt av: Ron
I cannot comment on other types of hunts because we are here to discuss Norwegian whaling but the same priciple applies. If the animal is to be killed it must be killed as quickly and painlessly as possible.

This is the whale kill we were able to document. If the Norwegian Government or the Norwegian whalers would like to invite us to film the hunts from the boats we would be very pleased to do so. It would mean we had documentation of more hunts.

Jennifer
 

Where to focus our energy and resources and what to put on the agenda

    I will not get into the discussion on whether whale hunting is humane or whether the whales being hunted are to be considered an endangered species.

    However, I do believe the world is facing far more pressing problems, namely the hunger, diseases and violence that millions of people living in Africa face today. Do you not consider this a more pressing matter that you should focus your energy and resources towards?
    Innsendt av: Grete
I personally financially support many organisations tackling the very important issues that the developing world faces. I don't think that we should neglect problems such as whale welfare because other large problems exist.
 

Alternatives?
    Are there any more humane alternatives to the current way of killing whales?
    Would it really be unproblematic to let the species grow without limitations?
    Thanks
    Innsendt av:
Because of the nature of whaling and the techniques being used, it is impossible to ensure the whale is killed immediately. We are no where near the populations of whales growing out of control and there are real concerns about the impact of environmental change on whale piopulations.

Jennifer
 

Get a life

    This is food, million off people in the world dies and you run after a whale. Get a life. Start too help people in afrika.
    Innsendt av: svein H.
Caring about the welfare of whales does not exclude me from the ability to care about people in Africa.
 

Stupid Reaction
    Let all the people who reacts negatively to the whale fishing go into a normal slaughtehouse! The would propably not like what they see there either, but still they want hamburgers and beef. Talking about double morality!
    Innsendt av: Thor Loenning
I don't want to get into a debate about eating meat in general but as I've already said as a vegetarian I don't believe that we should inflict suffering on any animals. There are plenty of organisations exposing appalling welfare standards in slaughterhouses and I personally fully support them.
 

What about...
    Hi!

    I'm not about to defend the way this particular Whaleboat goes about with its work. I just hope it was an exception to the rule for how it is usually done.
    My question is: Hwo's taking care of the rights of the many bulls in Spain? Slaughtered for the amusement of a big crowd... They don't even do it for the meat - it's too full of adrenalin-acid(?) to be eaten. Tormented a long time, before finally getting a sword stuck down its neck! Thats crime against animals, if you ask me!!!
    Innsendt av: lillevenn
I agree with you that bullfighting is unacceptble. I hope for the sake of the whales killed that this kill is an exception.

Jennifer
 

I'M SORRY!!!

    I'm really sorry about these STUPID people.. I hope people don't think all norwegians are like that...
    It's embarresing...
    Innsendt av: Me
I don't think Norwegian people are stupid!
 

1 Observation is not evidence
    Dear Ms. Lonsdale,

    Would you agree to the statement: "Criticising a whole industry based on one observation is fair." ?
    Innsendt av: Jacob Wibe
This is a random example of how a whale was killed in Norway this summer. We didnt choose this whale kill because it took a long time,it was the one we were able to document. We would like the Norwegian Government to show the IWC film of other whale kills.

Jennifer
 

How can you

    There is alot of whale which are killed on a human way, and there is a few accidents as the film shows.
    How can we eat meat if one kill like this is set to be representative for all killing of animals/whales. You should know that accident happens in any kind of hunts and any kind of butcher.

    How can you support one film like this that shows an accident ?
    Innsendt av: Pj
Unfortunately this hunt was filmed completely at random which leads us to question whether 'accidents' of this nature actually occur far more frequently than is known. We would be very pleased to view footage from the Norwegian Government of other whales killed in the hunts.
 

Investigative Journalism?
    Dear Ms. Lonsdale

    I am a Norwegian living in London and saw the article about your film in yesterday's Metro. I was appaled - not because of the hunt, but of the nature of your journalism. Do you really believe that filming one incident (that admittadly was a wrongdoing) gives grounds to your claim, "clerely there is no humane way of killing a whale at sea"? This is not satisfactory investigative journalism, and it saddens me that stunts like that is used to inform urban people of whaling. In relation to other forms of hunting and indeed domestic meat trade, whaling is no worse. Simply because people are being given a romantic, disneyfied notion of the whale as some greater form of being, does not mean that should influence an informed opinion. The killing of the whale in your film was clearly not humane, but there is nothing that suggests shuch a happening is everyday. The minky whale is not indangered in our waters, and a controlled harvesting is viable. Eating it is no different from eating beef.

    Anders Alterskjaer
    Innsendt av: Anders Alterskjaer
We would like the Norwegian Government to provide film of Norwegian whale kills to the International Whaling Commission so that we can see how other kills take place. This is the hunt that we were able to film and the fact is it take along time to die. The whale the BBC filmed being killed took over 2 minutes. With a moving vessel and a moving whale it is impossible to be sure that the harpoon will hit the whale in an area of the body which kills it immediately. That is one of the problems with whaling.
I am not getting into the merits of eating whale compared to eating beef but there is a conservation imperative attached to Norwegian minke whales in that we cannot be sure how many whales there are because counting techniques are extremely inaccurate and we do not know how the impacts of environmental changes to the marine ecosystem will affect whales

Jennifer
 


    what is so bad about whale "killing" compared to other hunting? i can agree on the fact that the hunting of endangered species is not wanted, but when the stock is sustainable and it is all happening under strict control, what is the problem?
    Innsendt av: simen
I think this kill shows that the Norwegian whale hunting is not carried out perfectly and it is impossible to carry it out perfectly. There is also concern about the sustainability of whaling because of the unknown effects of environmental change on the marine ecosystem. Looking at whaling in its own right rather than trying to compare one type of hunting with another - and I am not expressing an opinion one way or another on other types of hunt - with a moving boat and a moving whale it is impossible to ensure you kill the whale immediately.

Jennifer
 

Why is this bad?

    Have you seen what usa does agains people? have you seen what the english people kill the fox?

    You can see Norway is not more bad than the rest of the world!
    Why you cant see to your own country first?!!
    Innsendt av: Whong le
Actually we have just banned fox hunting in the UK and I am very pleased we have.I dont believe that Norwegians are bad people.

Jennifer
 

The cow comparison

    Why protect the whales if they're no more intelligent than a cow? Or are they more intelligent?

    I would like you to point me to some independent scientific sources that would give a sound basis for saying that whales are - in and of themselves - more worthy of protection than any other animal humans hunt and use for food and other tings.

    Innsendt av: The sceptic
I dont think whales are any more worthy of protection than any other animal.Actually research carried out on some whales and dolphins indicate that some species have a brain as complex as the human brain, especially the area associated with intelligence and congnitave.
This is an issue of welfare and conservation. Consumption of farmed animals is an important issue but we are not discussing it here.

Jennifer
 


    I agree that they shouldn't kill the whales like that but what are we supposed to do when we get to many of them.. maybe not in the nearest future but if we totally stop there are going to be to many.. what then? a mass masacre?
    Innsendt av: chris
It is not very good science to be believing that we will reach a stage where there are too many whales. For a start the methods used to count whales are very inaccurate and there is great uncertainty on just how many whales there are in the oceans. There is also growing concern about the effects that threats to the marine environment such as ozon depletion, over fishing, pollution and climat change will have on whale population and the marine ecosystem. Collectively these are more threatening that the harpoon

Jennifer
 

its not ok!

    but its human to do mistakes in the killingproccess. I dont think the men onboard the ship like to torture animals, do you?
    why dont you send money to children in africa?
    Innsendt av: Frank
I am sure the men on board dont purposely fire the harpoon at the whale so that it suffers a prolonged death. The whole point is that with a moving whale and a moving boat it is impossible to be sure that the harpoon will hit the whale in a part of the body that will ensure that it is killed immediately.
I have great concern for children in Africa but we are talking here about Norwegian whaling.

Jennifer
 

How come?

    Hi Jennifer.

    I have a little question. This is one case with bad luck for the whale "hunters", but do you have any documentation of any kind, how they have killed all the other whales? As the article states, you came to Norway, got one shot of film and then left. Have you ever seen the movie, 9/11 made by Michael Moore? This was supposed to be a documentary, but he has only seen one side of the story. You seem to be cought in the same trap. And to be very honest with you, I have never eaten whale meat and have not made up my mind if I am against whale "hunting" or not, yet.


    Innsendt av: Tom - From Oslo
Actually it is not easy to document a Norwegian whale hunt as I think the whalers will tell you. Not all of the boats hunt near enough to the shore to show detail of the kill on film. I can see where you are coming from but all I can say is that we didnt choose this kill because it was long. It was what we came across. I would have prefered the whale kill to be quick but it was not. The Norwegian Government says that over 80% of whales are killed within two minutes. The whale kill that the BBC filmed took over two minutes to die. I would like to see film of other whale kills in Norway but the Norwegian government has never shown any at the IWC meetings.

Jennifer
 

Several questions

    1: How is whaling different from any other kind of hunting a wild animal. Is whaling in any way less acceptable than hunting e.g deer?

    2. How is the 14 minutes that whale suffered worse than the somtimes much longer suffering of domesticated animals (read cattle or sheep) beeing transported and slaughtered under poor conditions?

    3. Why am I left with the feeling that environmentalist / animal rights organizations only pursue the cases that won't leave the average american consumer (read: person that may donate money) with a guilty conscience for their own actions?
    Innsendt av: NN
1. I am not going to get into the merits of one type of hunting compared to another.

2. No animal should be subjected to a time to death of over 14 minutes - in the wild of in the slaugher house.

3. Whaling is an extremely important issue as are the other issues that EIA and WSPA address. I am writing as a representative of EIA and I can assure you that we choose the issues we work on because they are critical and we can make a difference and not because they raise loads of money. Where ever we can we focus issues on the consumer and not just those carrying out the action we are documenting. Exploitation and consumption go hand in hand and I am not just talking about whaling but also illegal logging, ozone depletion, ivory trading etc etc.

Jennifer
 

Whales and things...

    Do you know how long it takes before a bull dies in bullfighting in Spain? About the same as the poor whale in Vadsø. But that bull is killed for fun! Why dont you use your resources were they are needed? Instead of attacking people whos lives depend on whales?
    Innsendt av: Christine
I do not like bullfighting and find it totally unacceptable that people can find such activities "fun". That does not mean that I think whaling is OK. I am not attacking people I am criticising the method that whales are killed which is unacceptable in a modern society

Jennifer
 

Rediculous

    I find this whole video rediculous. They are killing a whale in 15 minutes. The endorfines in the whales body has prevented it for feeling any pain. It dies in the end. If it left with the harpune still attached without dieing I would react, but this does not happen. Groups like WESPA and EIA should pay more attention to animal suffering in Central Europe were farm animals live under terrible conditions their whole life.. This whale was free all its life.. It ended in 15 minuts.. Not a big deal. People around the world have more suffering than this whale ever had during its life and death.

    I m not a big supporter of norwegian whaling, but this is video is not something i would categorize as animal suffering. Animal suffering is when animals live their whole life in pain and then it ends.


    Innsendt av: Jo Tonnessen
WSPA does work on the issue of the welfare of farm animals. Actually this whale did die with the harpoon still attached as well as suffering seven rifle shots. I dont know enough about endorphines and their ability to mask paid but I would prefer to speculate on the side of the possibility of experiencing pain rather than the speculation that the endorphine masks it - whether it be a human or a whale suffering.
Just because we care about the suffering inflicted on whales does not mean that we do not care about the suffering of people and other animals.

Jennifer
 

Small fish?

    Why is it better that small fish disappears in stead of big animals - like whales.
    Are you aware of the fact that whales are to blame for the disappearence of several types of small organisism in the sea. How can you decide what life we should protect?


    Innsendt av: Lisa
Actually if you examin the science of the balance of the ecosystem you will find that the answer to the disappearance of fish stocks and other marine organisms is not because whales have eaten them all but because man has over fished the oceans and destroyed much of the marine ecosystems that these organisms rely on for their existance. The arguement of whales eating fish is a false one. For millions of years whales have been an important part of the marine ecosystem.

Jennifer
 

why?

    why is it not forbidden to catch hvale??
    It is not an animal who cares about human, like sharks it. It is a nice and sweet animal..

    My parents love the meat from the hvale, but i really hats it.. I dont like to eat a nice hvale.



    Innsendt av: MIss
It is interesting for me to read your opinion on whaling. I am sure there are other people in Norway that feel the same.

Jennifer
 

Gourmet

    Have you tasted whale?
    Innsendt av: Espen
I have spent a lot of time documenting whale hunts but I have never tasted whale because I dont eat meat or fish

Jennifer
 

Statistics

    Ms. Lonsdale.
    I understand you passion for the topic when we see footage like this. But let me ask you this. Do you beileve that accidents happen, and things do not always go as planned? In all fairness to the whalers; You can not judge the whole whaling industry based upon one unfortunate happening!! I see no statistic involved here of how many shots goes wrong and how many are considered "humane killings".
    In -95 you write "Never do the hunters acknowledge the simple ethical fact that if you cannot kill without causing suffering, then you should not kill."
    My second question to you is then "Have you ever eaten a hamburger?"
    The farm animals go through a lot more than just these 14 minutes.

    -jens-
    Innsendt av: -jens-
I personally do not eat meat or fish and have never eaten a meatburger - only a veggieburger and that is my choice. I am not going to get into the reasons why I dont eat meat or fish and am here to answer the questions on this whale hunt. In this case I am reporting on what we documented. The way it happened was that the whale were were able to film took over 14 minutes to die and that is unacceptable. How many others take longer than 2 minutes?

Jennifer
 

mistake

    Norwegian journalists are not very good in geography, and in the text it is claimed that the hunt is done from the port of Bardu. Bardu is an inland area known for salomon fishing and military acctivities...hundreds of kilometers from wher this took place... in Vardø. there is room for improvement in the accuracy in translations too. make sure they listen when you talk.
    Innsendt av: alfkramer
In our materials it clearly states Vardo

Jennifer
 

Fish suffer too?

    Does EIA differentiate animal suffering according to species, or is the slow hauling in of fish on a hook in principle as bad as the killing of this whale?
    Innsendt av: Robert
I dont wish to get into the comparisons between whaling and fishing. I do believe that the suffering that the whale we documented being killed was totally unacceptable and I believe that millions of other people will think the same thing. I do believe, however, that it is our responsibility to ensure that that the animals we kill are killed as quickly and painlessly as possible.

Jennifer
 

Jennifer!

    Why is it, that people like you from central parts of Europe, call for no whaling? Have you any concept of what it's like to live in remote areas of the world, relying on ie whaling for survival? Surely, the answer isn't for everyone to live in major cities in central countries. What do you suggest the coastal population of Norway, Greenland, Iceland, and Russia do for a living? Become hairdressers?
    Innsendt av:
No I dont think it is for everyone to live in major cities in central countries and I dont think that everyone should become hairdressers. At the same time I think there is a difference between aboriginal communities and those in a country such as Norway and I dont wish to mix the types of whaling that are carried out in these two types of communities. I also do not believe that whaling is necessary in a modern 21st Century country.

Jennifer
 

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